[__XIS__]

For those of you that have Dinantronics installed, they recently updated the app. The modes are much easier to select and know at a glance what mode you are in, but the real-time boost gauge is missing. Hopefully they fix that little bug, but even if they didn't, it is a nice improvement.
Dinantronics has been the best and most enjoyable $300 I have spent on her.
https://www.dinancars.com/products/...A250&submodel=&engine=&bodytype=Sport+Utility

 

[Bill Gougler]

for everyone - I am evaluating an AMG 45 or a qx30 (yes the same car but -that engine)
I live at 5500 feet and drive up the hill a lot

how much HP has anyone seen gotten safely out the "enhanced" 2.0 t in the Qx 30

Dinan chip
turbo valve
then maybe a cool air intake ?

easier mods - not full exhaust or turbo
does it just feel better ? Any dyno tests ? Or if feels like 30-50 more hp?

Thank you in advance for the update

 

[__XIS__]

I love the extra HP & torque from that simple little Dinan plug in, but it still does not remotely come close to an AMG 45. I have never had any car dyno'd. They (Dinan) claim an increase of up to 30 HP and 40 lbs of torque. You can definitely tell it has more power, but I couldn't tell you actual numbers. I am more than glad I have it and would buy it again if I had to do it over.
My minor mods are that my QX30 has Dinantronics, a K&N drop in and a resonator delete. I am more than happy with performance and smile every time I drive it.

 

[Bill Gougler]

perfect answer - thank you

I ( like others) will go with the Dinan plug in -improved air filter and a good idea
remove the resonator ....less back pressure

anything else is big $$ and extensive mods

 

[p07r0457]

I ( like others) will go with the Dinan plug in -improved air filter and a good idea
remove the resonator ....less back pressure

AFAIK, no one has actually put a qx30 on a dyno and provided any evidence that any of this works. I’ve seen other forums where the masses swear by mods that are later scientifically proven to HURT performance.

Maybe I have higher standards? But I couldn’t fathom doing these mods based on the “trust us” puffing of the marketing wank.

And anytime I see a k&n filter recommended I know that empirical evidence and knowledge are absent.

 

[__XIS__]

MODERATOR DELETED THIS POST:

Deleting this puerile sniping.

You two need to grow up and learn to ignore each other. Last warning.

 

[SBICK36]

Just Installed my Dinantrontics boost controller! I already downloaded the app so the whole installation took 5 min and I was in my QX30 driving it. I put in in Race and the transmission in Sport and WHOAA!!! what a difference! It doesn't pull much past 5000 rpm but the torque is awesome. I also have an AEM intake system installed as well but this boost controller is it! If you can open a hood of a car and jiggle some wires around you can install it.

 

[Jim Ferland]

Happy New Year, ya’ll!! Happy to say I too have added the Dinantronics Sport Tuner as well as the GFB DV+ upgrade today. Initial pulls definitely feel better w/more torque. In Sport + mode, it’s now scratching rubber when it shifts to 2nd. Still need to learn the app, so I can get more from it. Very easy to do, thanks to some great videos out there. Definitely worth the $500..

 

[Smittylit]

Just FYI, if you're interested in "secret" mode on tuner (must have Android App), try:

"If you tap down from the settings screen, you will see an auto-connect option that is greyed out. There is a check-box to the right of that. You have to tap that check box 20 times. You may want to try regular race mode before accessing the max mode."

If you read older threads about this tuner, I was in contact with the lead engineer at Dinan (Dinan merged with another company out of Alabama) and he gave me some good advice.
@p07r0457 -- I can only go by Dinan's test results with using the same piggyback--but, yeah, of course the company who designed it who is also running the tests is not always the most reliable. I couldn't find an independent test run on it outside of Dinan, though. It'd be interested in other piggyback scientific tests done by independent companies on either a Dinan or other company's piggyback. Can you send some links that show where other Piggybacks made performance worse with the scientific results from independent sources?

Dinan, btw, has an open offer to anyone here to come to either their CA or AL facility to test out their piggyback on a QX30 since they've only done the tests on the Mercedes GLA for this piggyback. Let me know, and I can pass on their engineer's contact info.

 

[p07r0457]

@p07r0457 -- I can only go by Dinan's test results with using the same piggyback--but, yeah, of course the company who designed it who is also running the tests is not always the most reliable. I couldn't find an independent test run on it outside of Dinan, though. It'd be interested in other piggyback scientific tests done by independent companies on either a Dinan or other company's piggyback. Can you send some links that show where other Piggybacks made performance worse with the scientific results from independent sources?

I'd like to point out that the onus shouldn't fall to me to prove ECU tunes have problems -- rather the responsibility should fall the the ECU tune companies to prove they don't...

But since I like debate/discussion, I'll provide this link:

https://motorblock.at/stalzamt-die-wahrheit-ueber-chiptuning-spassbringer-oder-motorentod/

and an interesting analysis from Reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/6wrkhc/the_truth_about_chiptuning_very_long_read/

 

[__XIS__]

Lol

 

[Smittylit]

I'd like to point out that the onus shouldn't fall to me to prove ECU tunes have problems -- rather the responsibility should fall the the ECU tune companies to prove they don't...

But since I like debate/discussion, I'll provide this link:

https://motorblock.at/stalzamt-die-wahrheit-ueber-chiptuning-spassbringer-oder-motorentod/

and an interesting analysis from Reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/6wrkhc/the_truth_about_chiptuning_very_long_read/

Yep, I wasn't asking you to prove anything. Just asking for some links since ECU tuning problems isn't something I regularly research. I'm not in a debate but a neutral party (I got my tuner for free from Dinan to evaluate).

Is this an actual ECU tuner, though? I thought those were chips you connect to the onboard computer or something, which the Dinan piggyback is not. Dinan states that this alters the boost pressure through a single sensor. I thought tuners did more than that?

Thanks for sending along the links, though. The motorblock article author said "Stay away from manipulation on the control unit." Is this piggyback manipulating the "control unit" (in quotes because this article was translated from German to English).

I did find this interesting (if I understood it through the poor, but funny! translation):

"the copper content in the flask is increased. Copper is one of the best heat conductors and so you can give piston temperature to the engine oil faster. Second, chromium is added, allowing the piston to have higher strength at 420 ° C.
It can therefore be said that the more powerful engines use not only more pressure-resistant, but also "faster" alloys for the pistons. Unfortunately, a quick intervention in the engine control does not do that. The thermal capacity is exhausted, the piston weakened by operation in the overload range. In the worst case, it breaks through only in the fire - a capital engine damage is the result.

"As far as the damage is concerned, these only occur some time after the tuning. Usually there are problems after 50,000 to 80,000 km. Many then no longer own the vehicle and the subsequent owner often knows nothing of his luck. And then, in the case of many damages, they first drive to the workshop and then just swap them out. That the cause could be in the chip, many do not come to that - the tuner has said, it does not matter.

"And it is with great pleasure that the tuners (and not only those) spread that certain components are a wearing part - eg the turbocharger. [it]He is not! Turbos are broken by chiptuning or wrong handling. Previously, when turbos were the absolute exception, everyone knew that you drive a vehicle with turbo engine after the cold start best once in idle and the first 500m rather sneaks than drives to prevent the still cold turbo with a too high Exhaust gas temperature is confronted. Is also the reason why many who have a turbo damage often not only have one."

Not exactly sure what it means, but would the Dinan piggyback be altering the "thermal capacity" like driving your turbo car cold ("wrong handling")? Is that the underlying issue here? Is adding boost pressure through the sensor the same as tuning the car and altering the turbocharger?

Ironically, the article also said "Of course, this text does not apply to all engines. There are some manufacturers who assume that their engines are still properly styled by the owners. Especially good for Japanese products." Infiniti is Japanese, but... our car is not.

Interesting stuff here.

 

[p07r0457]

Is this an actual ECU tuner, though? I thought those were chips you connect to the onboard computer or something, which the Dinan piggyback is not. Dinan states that this alters the boost pressure through a single sensor. I thought tuners did more than that?

It could be argued that the Dinan is more dangerous than a full tuner, then. OEM ECUs use a lot of lookup-tables, which make a lot of assumptions. If you're modifying individual sensors or triggers then you're causing a misunderstanding between what is actually happening and what the ECU thinks is occurring. This is why companies said they developed full tuners -- to remove and/or recalculate the lookup-tables to accurately control the system.

The motorblock article author said "Stay away from manipulation on the control unit." Is this piggyback manipulating the "control unit" (in quotes because this article was translated from German to English).

I'd argue it's just as bad, or possibly worse. Instead of manipulating the ECU you're effectively throwing away it's commands and coming up with your own. You could make more power under some circumstances, but you may lose some in others, and you definitely could be putting longevity at risk. People tend to forget that the ECU is also monitoring conditions to keep things healthy.

"As far as the damage is concerned, these only occur some time after the tuning. Usually there are problems after 50,000 to 80,000 km. Many then no longer own the vehicle and the subsequent owner often knows nothing of his luck. And then, in the case of many damages, they first drive to the workshop and then just swap them out. That the cause could be in the chip, many do not come to that - the tuner has said, it does not matter.

"And it is with great pleasure that the tuners (and not only those) spread that certain components are a wearing part - eg the turbocharger. [it]He is not! Turbos are broken by chiptuning or wrong handling. Previously, when turbos were the absolute exception, everyone knew that you drive a vehicle with turbo engine after the cold start best once in idle and the first 500m rather sneaks than drives to prevent the still cold turbo with a too high Exhaust gas temperature is confronted. Is also the reason why many who have a turbo damage often not only have one."[/COLOR]

This is pointing out that the negative effects of tunes and piggybacks are typically seen after many miles -- because it's the longevity that typically suffers. The vendors selling these aftermarket accessories will blame the turbocharger and say it's a "wearable part" much like brake pads. They'll claim their system had nothing to do with the premature failure. But the reality is that vehicle with these systems tend to experience increased engine problems and turbocharger failures compared to unaltered vehicles.

Not exactly sure what it means, but would the Dinan piggyback be altering the "thermal capacity" like driving your turbo car cold ("wrong handling")? Is that the underlying issue here? Is adding boost pressure through the sensor the same as tuning the car and altering the turbocharger?

Yes, increasing boost pressure beyond what is commanded by the ECU will generate considerably more heat than the system was expecting.

Ironically, the article also said "Of course, this text does not apply to all engines. There are some manufacturers who assume that their engines are still properly styled by the owners. Especially good for Japanese products." Infiniti is Japanese, but... our car is not.

I think engines like the 2JZ-GTE and 1UZ-FE are good examples of engines that were "over-built" in most trims. However, I do not think this applies to newer Japanese engines. At any rate the engine in the QX30 has nothing Japanese about it. Infiniti did not contribute one iota to the design. This powertrain is 100% Mercedes.

 

[Smittylit]

"It could be argued that the Dinan is more dangerous than a full tuner, then. OEM ECUs use a lot of lookup-tables, which make a lot of assumptions. If you're modifying individual sensors or triggers then you're causing a misunderstanding between what is actually happening and what the ECU thinks is occurring. This is why companies said they developed full tuners -- to remove and/or recalculate the lookup-tables to accurately control the system." It could be, I suppose? But the lookup tables are going to have scripts, though, that fail on conditions and throw an error. As I understand it, full on ECU tuners often have failures with check engine lights, codes, etc. That does not seem to be the case with a tuner that alters a single sensor. Indeed, I would think with this engine that has a baked-in allowable range of turbo pressure, 2-3 PSI falls within that margin that would probably not even trigger a warning from a mismatch at the table record level.

"you definitely could be putting longevity at risk. People tend to forget that the ECU is also monitoring conditions to keep things healthy." I still think that, yes, could be putting it at risk. At what point? 80k miles? 100k? The article's assumption about it happening sooner with an ECU tuner still doesn't seem to apply here. Every mechanic I've spoken to since before I bought this car said... buy whatever now. Toyota... Honda... they've baked it in there to have failures. I'm not keeping a car past 100k anymore. Had a Toyota and even a Saab that lasted almost to 200k, but I don't think that's the case anymore.

"Yes, increasing boost pressure beyond what is commanded by the ECU will generate considerably more heat than the system was expecting." Well, no, that's not what the article is saying. It's saying it's not warming enough with ECUs--it's "exhausting" the thermal temperature that the metals thrive off of. Like gunning a cold, turbocharged engine. But, heat is the enemy, so that could be a negative effect for sure.

"I think engines like the 2JZ-GTE and 1UZ-FE are good examples of engines that were "over-built" in most trims. However, I do not think this applies to newer Japanese engines. At any rate the engine in the QX30 has nothing Japanese about it. Infiniti did not contribute one iota to the design. This powertrain is 100% Mercedes." But, then again, the article centered on BMW. This is not a BMW engine either, and though they did coat the motor differently for the AMG model, Mercedes took this same engine and boosted the turbo to 26 PSI, a far, far cry from what this tuner is doing.

"This is pointing out that the negative effects of tunes and piggybacks are typically seen after many miles -- because it's the longevity that typically suffers." No, it's not pointing out the effects of piggybacks, unless I'm misunderstanding ECU tuners vs. piggybacks. They are not the same, right? One remaps a lot of stuff (whether ignoring or adding records to the lookup tables) and one simply adds pressure. I'm not an engineer, so I don't know.

"I'd argue it's just as bad, or possibly worse. Instead of manipulating the ECU you're effectively throwing away it's commands and coming up with your own. You could make more power under some circumstances, but you may lose some in others, and you definitely could be putting longevity at risk. People tend to forget that the ECU is also monitoring conditions to keep things healthy." I'm still not convinced this is over-riding any commands at the ECU level aside from adding boost pressure. I didn't see anything in that article or Reddit thread saying such about a piggyback.

 

[p07r0457]

Ignorance is bliss.

This is why I don't trust used cars. You can't trust the previous owner.

 

[__XIS__]

LOL, ignorance...

 

[fastrack]

Well.. My M4 is Dinan stage 2 treated. Everything is fine (#knockonwood), and BMW supports it. Enough said..

Stage 1
Labor Hours/Installation Hours 1.50
Emission Status 50 State Emissions Legal. California Air Resources Board Executive Order Number D-176-42.
Max HP Gain 42 @ 6000 RPM
Max Torque Gain 47 @ 3500 RPM
Peak Horsepower 516 @ 6000 RPM
Peak Torque 489 @ 3500 RPM
Factory Rated HP 425 (484 Measured)
Factory Rated Torque 406 (446 Measured)
Included Notes DINANTRONICS Performance Tuner, Dinan wiring harness, Dinan Stage 1 software

Stage 2
Labor Hours/Installation Hours 1.50
Emission Status 50 State Emissions Legal. California Air Resources Board Executive Order Number D-176-42.
Max HP Gain 56 @ 6000 RPM
Max Torque Gain 58 @ 4000 RPM
Peak Horsepower 530 @ 6000 RPM
Peak Torque 504 @ 4000 RPM
Factory Rated HP 425 (484 Measured)
Factory Rated Torque 406 (446 Measured)
Included Notes DINANTRONICS Performance Tuner, Dinan wiring harness, Dinan Stage 2 software
Required Items Cold Air Intake is recommended.

 

[Bill Gougler]

that is a ? I have a new CPO 2018. If this is plugged in does it void the warranty?

Do you remove and reinstall after every visit?

And yes on loving the AMG - but the wife thought it was too harsh - abrupt and the Qx 30 (with all options ) was just a better value

and advice or experience ? thank you in advance

 

[fastswimmerguy]

Dinan, btw, has an open offer to anyone here to come to either their CA or AL facility to test out their piggyback on a QX30 since they've only done the tests on the Mercedes GLA for this piggyback. Let me know, and I can pass on their engineer's contact info.

Has Dinan found a QX30 to work with? Where in CA are they? I live in SoCal and would be interested in possibly helping them test their piggyback

 

[p07r0457]

that is a ? I have a new CPO 2018. If this is plugged in does it void the warranty?

If you have a problem with your turbocharger or another system that Infiniti determines may be affected by the piggyback, then yes, your warranty would not apply.